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Rain Sensor vs cloud watcher

So Thanks to Rudolphe who pointed me in this direction...

the Arduino Leonardo dome controller has an input for the rain sensor right?

And if driver low, it will close the shutter for safety?

so with the AAG CloudWatcher I just purchased I see that it has a terminal block lead. It is meant to provide an input to the controller for directing it to close.

so is the signal from the CloudWatcher the same as rain sensor/ driven Low if cloudy or “unsafe”? I presume you set the unsafe condition in the program on the PC, which sets when the CloudWatcher will trigger the unsafe signal?

Looks like those conditions are set by the user.

so if it sends a valid close signal like the rain sensor, the dome will send a shutter close command?

And back on the PC the shutter state will report as ‘closed’ in the driver (ascom or x2)?

Sorry to be so thick. I just want to get this right for something so important that protects my gear.

17 comments

17 Comments

Ron Crouch

Jun 19, 2019

Regarding the AAG rain sensor. It is critical to make sure the edges around the rain sensor are well-sealed. IF not after long soaker days water can get under it and it will not ever say things are dry again until you bring it inside and dry well. Eventually the water underneath will destroy the sensor. I used a thin bead of DAP rapidfuse (light blue cap) and let it age a few hours to seal.

Ron Kramer

Jun 19, 2019

I have the AAG and SOLO. Rain sensor from nexdome isn't needed with these. Mine closes upon clouds OR the tiniest drop of drizzle or even as dawn starts and the sky gets slightly lit before sun rise. The drawback is you need a PC (I use a nuc) running in the dome. Which is usually the case when imagine anyway. You run the cloudwatcher software on teh PC. (in addition to the solo option which isn't needed really but I like the fancy display). The little cloudwatcher util will run a script at the sign of unsafe. dim dome

set dome = CreateObject( "POTH.dome" )

call dome.OpenShutter()

set dome = nothing

dim dome

set dome = CreateObject( "POTH.dome" )

call dome.CloseShutter()

set dome = nothing

I WOULD like to hard wire (I have no idea how) if possible so that when the solo says it's unsafe it closes. you can view my solo here. http://kramers.mynetgear.com:10443/ I trust it 100%.

Ron Crouch

Jun 19, 2019

Replying to

Hi! I also use the AAG+Solo PI. ACP reads the one line weather file and acts appropriately. With a weather alert it does exactly what my weather script asks. After clearing + the extra wait time imaging session resumes with reopening. Very robust and cool. Has given me many extra mights I otherwise would not have even tried.

I also have the NexDome rain sensor connected. I did not have it connected for about 6 months of use with the AAG Solo. Now it in place as backup and is physically located so that the first squirt from back yard sprinkler system will hit and at least with 2.11 triggers instant closure. If this happens ACP will see this as a closure it did not request and halt everything instantly as well and not resume. Send me an email saying operator intervention is needed.

I added the rain sensor back in for backup and to protect myself from other folks in the house hold as well as myself making a timing error with sprinklers. Normally ACP shuts down and closes up dome about an hour before sunrise. So long as sprinklers are programmed for after that the exact sensor is not needed. Having said that it is an excellent very sensitive rain sensor.

Rodolphe

Apr 20, 2019

•

Sorry to be late to the party.

pin7 is indeed the input for the rain sensor signal. Depending on the shield you have there might already be a block header to connect it with both+12V and GND available in addition to the signal itself.

You should only need to run a signal+ground par of wire to the shield and let whatever sensor you're using control the signal to bring it to ground when rain (or whatever event you're detecting) is detected.

dave4robots

Apr 21, 2019

Replying to

Thanks. I think the AAG is a simple open close relay, so easy to ground the pin when AAG says unsafe.

Ron Crouch

Apr 21, 2019

Replying to

@dave4robots Now just for completeness.. The AAG can be configured so that relay is closed when unsafe (I think default) or the reverse. Easy to check with volt/ohm meter :-).

Good Luck!

Ron

Ron Crouch

Apr 17, 2019

This is a bit sad to hear because without weather safety it really cannot even be thought of as a viable automation client. I did not even consider X2 for my dome because dome automation in TSX is yet another $ upgrade. In the end I just personally considered ACP to be a better value because it is so solid, well-supported, and fully functional both for science and pretty picture imaging. You might look into Voyager which I've heard great things about.

dave4robots

Apr 18, 2019

Replying to

So it looks like from the code on GitHub that pin7 is rain sensor And it’s pulled up. So connecting that pin to ground signals that rain is detected. So should I be able to connect one wire for the AAG CloudWatcher relay to ground somewhere on the board and the other to pin 7? I’m pretty sure I can identify it because the rotate buttons on the front connect to 5 and 6.

The aag AAG says that on unsafe it can close tthe relay, thus connecting pin7 to ground. Bam, hardware safety.

Anyway unless is going to destroy my controller I think maybe it’s worth a try. But I will try to confirm to avoid a costly mistake.

Ron Crouch

Apr 18, 2019

Replying to

@dave4robots Just put a volt meter between the two terminals on the AGG. Be on volts! You should see essentially zero. Switch to ohms and measure. If relay is open it should be open. do something to trigger unsafe like sprinkle water on the rain sensor or cover with your hand..You should see it close on the ohm meter. If this test looks cool you should be fine.

Having done that keep in mind that the AAG has a configurable time to hold unsafe after the rain or cloud event clears.

Best,

Ron

dave4robots

Apr 19, 2019

Replying to

@Ron Crouch Thanks!

Ron Crouch

Apr 17, 2019

Regarding partly clouded is unsafe! Great idea. you really do not to image with clouds messing with things. If, on he other hand I'm engineering I turn weather safety off. In that situation the NexDome rain sensor is still insurance against surprise rain or sprinkler madness.

dave4robots

Apr 17, 2019

Replying to

I have asked on bisque forums and ‘the weather add on’ read $another 250$ Is in development but still not available to the public. The weather related commands are in the scripting description but not fully attached yet I guess.

Ron Crouch

Apr 17, 2019

Oh yeah.. closed is closed and both ASCOM and X2 would know. The point is that if my ACP automation client sees that and did not issue the command to close it will rightly assume a major situation has happened and abort everything and email me to intervene. If on the other hand closure happened because AAG CW told ACP conditions were bad and ACP itself managed the closure no issue at all and if it clears up session will resume.

RonC

dave4robots

Apr 17, 2019

Replying to

That sounds right in line with what I’m after. I will be running TheSkyX and not ACP or SGP on top. but TSX is highly scriptable. I’d love to translate your scripts into SkyX.

I want AAG wire connected to the rain sensor pin so I could trigger a shutter close if unsafe (BTW it would be nice to know how to connect to the Arduino. I am assuming one wire to ground, the other to the rain sensor pin if I knew where that was).

Then I‘d like to monitor shutter state in TheSkyX. If closed, move mount and dome to nice park position. Easy. If open, resume scripted imaging. I can poll it every 30 seconds or so during a session.

I could set partly cloudy condition as unsafe so rain should never even be a problem.

Does Es that sound reasonable?

Ron Crouch

Apr 17, 2019

Replying to

@dave4robots If you are using TSX weather safety tools WITH the AAG CW there would no good reason to wire the AAG to the rotator. Let TSX manage it all. You do not want something like shutter closes and tracking is left on!! I assume there are weather safety hooks in TSX but I really do not use TSX at all anymore in sessions so I do not know. So far 100% of the time (many many nights over years ) the AAG has caught things and the session kept rolling after clearing. Not yet used the terminal block switch and I've had the AAG CW for years.

Again.. if the forecast and radar picture looks dangerous I just wait for another night. Honestly wind with an open shutter is a more likely source of trouble for me than rain. If it's pointing into the wind it's a wind sock and will get knocked off it's track. Because of that I also have the AAG companion wind sensor and have it set that if things approach 30 mph weather safety in AAG says it's bad and the ACP client sees that, pauses session, and closes.

Ron Crouch

Apr 17, 2019

Hello! I have both a AAG Cloudwatcher and the NexDome Rainsensor. That terminal block in Cloudwatcher is just a switch which can be enabled or not to change state when "unsafe" (as defined in the AAG software or little companion PI Solo). It can turn things on/off (sinks fair amount of voltage) or just ground that rain-sensor pin in the rotator. Normally you use another piece of automation software which reads the AAG output text file.. such things as CCD Autopilot or ACP (what I use) will then send the commands to do things like move the dome to park charging tabs over terminals, close dome park scope etc. To take good advantage of the AAG CW a good automation client really helps because that can have smarts and know how to resume if things clear.

The NexDome rain sensor I use purely as insurance. If a wee bit of rain hits that shutter closes. Period. If that happens (rain sensor closure) my ACP automation sees the shutter closing, stops everything but aborts the session sending me an email for "Operator Intervention". If on other hand closure originated from the AAG CW ACP would do an orderly park dome close park scope and sit and wait for clearing. Things start right up when all is well as judged by AAG parameters.

On most nights I would consider imaging clouds would roll in and trigger closure long before rain. If it was a night with bad storms likely I would simply choose not to image. Even if I'm 2000 miles away it is easy to look at radar and get the general picture. The nexdome rain sensor also protects me if something like lawn sprinklers fire up. Like I said.. good insurance.

Bare in mind that the AAG does much more than sense rain. If you happen to use ACP I could share my startup/shutdown/weather scripts. They have been quite robust with 2.11 for a long time with many completely unattended night of imaging with me both home or far away.

Best,

Ron C